Thread: SQL question

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  1. #1
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    Default SQL question

    Well I know this is a littel off topic here. I tried doing a new install in a temp directory. When I answered the questions about db name I of course used the original database name. Bad idea. ZC over wrote without even a warning. And of course, I didnt save DB first because I thought ZC would warn me first.

    So here I am now with a tar file that sadistic tech support techs handed to me after I bravely told them I could easily restore the database if they gave me the file. And they gave me it in a format that they knew would keep me busy for quite some time. ie MYI, frm, and MYD files.

    So....deep breath. Punt?

    Any easy way to reassemble this database from what they gave me? I really dont want to have to crawl back to them.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: SQL question

    If I download mysql for windows and install it would I be moving in the right direction?

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    Default Re: SQL question

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelpadre View Post
    If I download mysql for windows and install it would I be moving in the right direction?

    Sometimes I scare myself.

    XAMMP did it for me. Dropped the backup files into the directory on my localhost then exported .sql

    I still question why ZC didnt warn me before overwriting existing database.

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    Default Re: SQL question

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelpadre View Post
    Sometimes I scare myself.
    LOL, no surprise really, you also appear to be talking to yourself :)

    My first comment.... Your host gave you the MY* files. Egads. They really were trying to make things hard for you. I don't think I've ever herard of a host doing this to one of their customers before. This makes them very clever (they knew which files to give you), or very stupid (they have no idea how to export an SQL database).

    I will also comment that I give you a *lot* of credit for figuring out how to do what you did, but will also add that you also just got lucky. These files have had several changes to their format over the years, and the general rule is that they will only work with the same DB version that they were created with, so things could have easily gone bad for you (I wonder if your host knew that?)

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelpadre View Post
    I still question why ZC didnt warn me before overwriting existing database
    It does give a warning. I don't know how you would have missed it. The upgrades give two options, create a new DB or update the existing one. Guess which one you selected?

    Don't kick yourself too hard though, I've done exactly the same thing myself ... (foolishly?) expecting it to actually create a complete new database even though I gave it the same credentials as the existing database. Doh!

    It is usually around this time that many people first learn the importance of doing thier own *full* backups before attemtping *any* upgrade of any kind. I do hope that you have now learned this very valuable lesson. If so, you'll also appreciate how this mistake is going to be of significant benefit to you in the long run, so consider it as good learning experience (true of any mistake really. Nothing wrong with making them, as long as you learn from it. Well, that's my philosophy, as such, I never really fear making a mistake. I guess its also how I've managed to learn so much about many things... its because I've messed up a lot, and hopefully will continue to do so.



    • Cheers
      Rod


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    Default Re: SQL question

    I still question why ZC didnt warn me before overwriting existing database
    I suppose you were expecting a popup after you selected install... no it doesn't do that. It assumes you have looked at the big warning notice before making your choice.

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    Default Re: SQL question

    My host and I have been feuding over the $20 they wanted to charge me to restore. I ultimately wrote them a bad review on a hosting review site and then everything changed. I told them whats the big deal to restore a database and why $20. Well they ultimately agreed to let me do it myself. And I wasnt surprised that they sent it to me in that strange format. But I knew if they gave it to me then it was possible to do it. And even after they asked me how I was doing with it, I told them I wasnt going to concede squat. So I kept snooping around. I knew somehow I was going to need to access mysql from root. A couple of google searches and I came up with xampp. I actually used it about 7 years ago to host my own website on my house computer. But I had forgotten about it.

    I didnt get lucky. I made sure that Mysql of my server was the same as the mysql of xampp. I did read that it "could" make a difference.

    I didnt get an option with the install. And that was because I didnt use the old config files. Had I used the old config files, ZC would have detected an earlier database. But clean install DOES NOT KNOW that there is a previous database. It just writes over without a word. IMHO that should be changed. Yes Yes I know, I didnt backup my DATABASE. But but but. I am so comfortable with installing ZC that I didnt do a backup.

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    Default Re: SQL question

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelpadre View Post
    My host and I have been feuding over the $20 they wanted to charge me to restore.
    This is actually quite a reasonable charge. Many hosts will charge a LOT more. Others won't even give the is an option.

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelpadre View Post
    I told them whats the big deal to restore a database and why $20.
    There are *many* answers and reasons for this, but the bottom line is, unless the host explicitely states that they offer a backup & restoration service *on demand* then they are under no obligation to do so.

    The backups that the hosts perform are to protect themselves (and their customers data) should anything go catastrophicaly wrong with the servers.

    They are not made so that every customer that makes a mistake can simply contact them and have things restored. Those that do provide this as a service usually charge for it it one way or another, either via an agreed fee, or they've calculated the expense into their hosting charges.

    Offhand I can't think of any industry that will perform a task or service for someone, free of charge, for mistakes made by their customers. This is no different.

    You were also well out of line in suggesting that it would have been no big deal to do the database restore for *you*.
    It *could* be true that they keep a form of backup that allows them to recover specific files with ease, but this is generally NOT the case (unless it is with a host that actually provides this as a service). Most server backups are not file based, they are drive based (well, the good/reliable ones are) and recovery of individual files simply isn't possible. It is an all or nothing process (that takes many minutes, as opposed to many hours that it would take to restore the same data using a file based backup system).

    In order to recover your files they could have (I'm not saying would have)
    1. Located the relevent storage tape.
    2. Extracted the entire data to an usused drive.
    3. mounted said drive to locate your files.
    4. Copy said files to somewhere that you can get them
    5. Erase the drive contents (security, privicy issues)
    6. Return the backup tape to a secure facility.

    Easily an hour (or more) work, just for *you*. Yes, it could be a big deal, but you'd have no way of knowing that.

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelpadre View Post
    Well they ultimately agreed to let me do it myself.
    If you had your own backups, then there would have been nothing to be agreed apon. You are expected to do

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelpadre View Post
    And I wasnt surprised that they sent it to me in that strange format
    On reflection, it doesn't really surprise me (other than it being unusual), as this would have have been the easiest, in fact the only format available to *them* after re-imaging a drive from their backup tapes. In order to have given the data in SQL format they would then have had to make the files avialalble to their MySQL server which in itself, would pose more difficulties at this point, because your 'corrupted files' would have the same names, so they'd need to set up a different server just to do an SQL dump for you. It could be said that it this point they could have simply replaced your existing files, which would have given you the backup you needed, but by this time you'd already insisted you wanted to do it yourself, so providing you with the MY* files was about all they could do without creating even more work for themselves than what would have been necessary if you were willing to let them do the restoration for you.

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelpadre View Post
    And even after they asked me how I was doing with it, I told them I wasnt going to concede squat.
    It was a fair valid question, designed to help you.

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelpadre View Post
    Yes Yes I know, I didnt backup my DATABASE. But but but. I am so comfortable with installing ZC that I didnt do a backup.
    This is one of the most foolish things I've read for a long time. Backups aren't designed for people with no confidence. The are to protect yourself from *any* unforeseen or unpredicable situation.

    I responded to your original post because I felt a liitle sorry for you over the fact that your host seemed to be intentionally making things difficult for you, not to mention to give you a pat on the back for the way you recovered.

    Sadly, I no longer feel this way. My sympathy is now 100% with your host, who in my opinion now seem to have gone out of their way to help you, in spite of the unrealistic demands (and threats) that you placed on them.

    Seriously, I think you owe your host an apology. As do I.

    My statement
    "They really were trying to make things hard for you. I don't think I've ever hrard of a host doing this to one of their customers before. This makes them very clever (they knew which files to give you), or very stupid (they have no idea how to export an SQL database)."

    Was unwarranted, and incorrect. It was a statement made before all the facts were known. I still have no idea who this host is. It isn't important. What is important is that whoever it is, they don't deserve any badmouthing or adverse publicity as a result of anything stated in this thread. I feel embarrasinlgy ashamed of myself.

    Regards
    Rod

  8. #8
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    Default Re: SQL question

    Problem with host was that the fee was arbitrary. I agree with most of what you said. If the TOS said $20 then I would have no problem. No where do they say backup files are paid for. I felt I was being victimized. Customer should not feel that way. As far as them having to spend 1 hour to retrieve a backup file, I would say that I am glad they dont work at the Pentagon.

    And my other host charges $12 year for any accidental data lose.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: SQL question

    The other thing I failed to mention was that unbeknownst to me, in January and February, all of my sites were taking 30+ seconds to load as tracked by my google webmaster tools. Servers were overloaded and they switched me to a different server. So in exchange of poor service and lost business for 2 months, I asked them to waive the $20. They absolutely stonewalled me until I was forced to bring it to the public arena in a webhosting review forum.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: SQL question

    Quote Originally Posted by pixelpadre View Post
    And my other host charges $12 year for any accidental data lose.
    No doubt they charge this fee regardless of whether you need to use this service or not, not to mention all the other users that are charged this fee under the same conditions. This is probably going to be quite a profitable part of their business. Even if only 10th of of the people on such a plan require a data restore that is still giving them the equlvilent of $120 each time. Actual figures would probably be closer to 1 customer per 100 will ever need this service.

    This makes it *very* viable for the host to provide the service. It offers good value to those *unfortunate* enough to need the service, but the majority of those paying get nothing in return other than peace of mind knowing its there if they do need it. No difference than paying insurance for your health, home or car really.

    Cheers
    Rod

 

 

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