Cart not charging shipping unless customer is logged in!

[Bikerstuff]

I just found my store is not charging shipping if a customer checks out with Paypal and is not logged into their store account!
I need to fix this quick! LOL
More important I thought I would mention this in case others have same issue and not found it yet!

Zencart v1.5.1 and I am using the built in cart and shipping stuff, and Paypal is the only way to pay!

What seems to happen is if I go to my store and do not log into my account I put items into my cart, go to my cart and I have the items and totals for the items but no shipping charge.
I can go to Paypal from there and there is NO shipping charge if I choose to pay for the order!
OR, I can go to Check out, then to Paypal, and still NO shipping charge if I pay for the order.

IF I log into my customer account then go look at the cart it shows the $8 flat rate shipping correctly as it should, and of course if I paid for the order I'd be paying the shipping!

So basically what is happening is a guest could shop at my store and place an order and NOT pay shipping, but a customer logged into their account DOES pay shipping!


What is the best way to fix this? I want everyone charged the flat rate shipping of course.
I would be happy to let folks shop and buy as a guest, I know allot of folks don't like making accounts for every little thing everywhere.

At this time I have my store set up for $8 flat rate shipping and free shipping over $75
using the built in Zencart modules.

I'll do some more searching and read the E-book I bought and hope I find my problems and why this happened like this.
I thought it would be good to post it also as maybe this is not a common issue and might help others later also once I find how to fix it. Also something to look for and check!

[Bikerstuff]

I found my answer!

It works strange for a guest! It did charge the shipping!
I could not complete a purchase myself since the Store uses my Paypal, I can't send myself a PayPal from the account into the same account. LOL

Wife woke up, middle of night here! She bought an item as a guest with her Paypal.

It seems the shipping is never shown in the store cart, click to pay with PayPal and when you get to the PayPal page it shows the cart total for the items in the cart but NO shipping Charge! Clicking to pay the order in Paypal then kicks the buyer back to a Store page to confirm the order, this is when the shipping charge was added and shown! Clicking to confirm the order the sale was made and done!

I think this is NOT a good way for it to work, I don't know if it can be changed in Zencart or not?
I know that when I go to any store to buy an item I will not buy anything or checkout to Paypal at all until I KNOW what the shipping and total charges are!
This basically means as it's working now, I would NEVER buy anything from my own store! LOL
If this were some other store I would never have gone as far as PAYPAL's site, and then there still had to click to buy, then sent back to the store page where finally the shipping did show!
Once I saw the shipping was working I told the wife just cancel the purchase and never mind. She was using a NOOK and she could not find anything on page to cancel the order and just quit either!

I do see now, the shipping is being charged to a guest, but it seems to be handled in a not to good of way.
Maybe with some more reading and searching I can find options to change it?

[RodG]

I do see now, the shipping is being charged to a guest, but it seems to be handled in a not to good of way.
Maybe with some more reading and searching I can find options to change it?

When a guest clicks on the PayPal button Zencart has no idea where the product is to be shipped, therefore it can't provide shipping costs until they come back to the store with the address data provided by PayPal. The total costs are then available when the order is confirmed.

Can you think of another way for this to be handled?

Cheers
RodG

[Bikerstuff]

Maybe guest enter the shipping address in the store cart before any links to go to Paypal?
Or at least the zipcode for USA, not sure what for other places?

I'm looking for a way too remove the first Paypal link also when first loading the cart.
When first going to the cart there is a PayPal link, and the option to go through checkout.
If folks use that first Paypal link I think they miss the checkout options to enter a GC code and not sure about a coupon code? Then in checkout there is the second Paypal link.

I think most the stores I shop at calculate the shipping on the zipcode, just enter zipcode in the cart, and shippings added to the cart total before ever entering any payment info, and before going to paypal.

[RodG]

Maybe guest enter the shipping address in the store cart before any links to go to Paypal?.
Or at least the zipcode for USA, not sure what for other places?

Then what will/should happen if PayPal has a different postcode/address than the one that the guest enters?

In your case it probably isn't going to be a big deal since you charge a flat rate regardless of destination, but with other sites this can easily lead to abuse or customer complaints that the amount charged isn't what was quoted.

I'm looking for a way too remove the first Paypal link also when first loading the cart.

I don't think there is a setting/option for that, but it shouldn't be too difficult to locate the code that displays the link and comment it out. The exact file/location would be dependant on the template/theme that you are using.

When first going to the cart there is a PayPal link, and the option to go through checkout.
If folks use that first Paypal link I think they miss the checkout options to enter a GC code and not sure about a coupon code? Then in checkout there is the second Paypal link.

I think the Express Checkout: Skip Payment Page has an effect on this behaviour.

I think most the stores I shop at calculate the shipping on the zipcode, just enter zipcode in the cart,

See my 1st comment about this.
Also, as far as 'most stores' go, I don't think I know of any that utilises Express Checkout *AND* requires the user to enter a zip code before checking out. It somewhat defeats the entire point of using express checkout, don't you think? Can you give an example of such a store?

and shippings added to the cart total before ever entering any payment info, and before going to paypal.

Seems to me that you need to configure your store so that customers need to create an account before adding products to the cart. You are trying to 'have your cake and eat it too'.

Cheers
RodG

[Bikerstuff]

I'm not sure about the Express Checkout, what it actually does or how it works, what it effects.

However I think the store should calculate the shipping costs and add them to the total before any method of checkout or payment so a customer knows what his REAL total will be.
$100 for an order is NOT the total if the customer is billed $125 later after the shipping is added on at a final page to confirm the order..

I'll have to look into how this works more, maybe disable express if I can?
If a customer has to enter the shipping address into the store cart that is fine, but they should still be able to pay with paypal using a credit card and no account there if they want.
That is what I thought the Express was!
I do want the customer to know the full amount they will be charged before leaving the store cart page though!

Almost everywhere I have bought without an account in the store but still paid with paypal has shown me the total of the order as I will be billed for it, not a part total and then more added later.
Though I normally log into my paypal account to pay and do not use credit card with paypal.

newegg.com comes to mind. I see the full total of the order I will be charged once I enter my zipcode and choose the shipping method I want to use, even when NOT logged into my account.
Then I decide how I want to pay, credit card or Paypal. Most the time I use my card, only paypal if there is a balance in the account I want to use up.

I do have an account at newegg because I did allot of business with them and it's very handy to look at past orders, even look up discontinued items I bought long ago to find details I forgot now like what CPU's a system board can use.
Most stores I will not even make an account at all, and rarely if ever for a first order!
So I do not want to force accounts with my store.
I know people like me will just say heck with it and leave the store and not buy anything before we will make an account at a unknown store.
If I see I am happy with a store and that I will be buying from them often then I may make an account and use it.

I may have made an account at a store for first order when I bought sand paper I needed. $15 for 100 sheets, and local I'd pay maybe $4 for 5 sheets! Placing a $100-$150 order there for 8x11 sheets and 6" adhesive disks saved me about $500 or so.
But that would be a rare exception that I made that store account for a first purchase!

[stevesh]

This question comes up from time to time. As RodG asked, how could Zencart calculate shipping costs before/unless the visitor enters his address ? As you know, Paypal (or any other payment processor) has no way of calculating shipping without knowing at least the customer's zipcode. The shipping estimator is just that - an estimator based on the zip code entered. That zip code is not passed to Paypal. The fact that Paypal Express is an off-site processor makes it necessary to add shipping costs on the customer's return to your shop. There's no way to 'fix' that.

I would be interested in a link to a store which adds shipping costs to my order if I don't create an account before I'm sent to Paypal using Express.

It's probably unreasonable to compare your shop to NewEgg or Amazon, both of whom require creation of an account. My personal opinion is that Zenners worry far too much about visitors balkng at creating an account if that function is made as simple as possible and the reasons to do so are explained. My thinking is that any visitor who leaves in a huff because you require account creation is a customer you probably don't want anyway.

[DrByte]

I'm looking for a way too remove the first Paypal link also when first loading the cart.
When first going to the cart there is a PayPal link, and the option to go through checkout.

Easy: Go to Admin->Modules->Payment->PayPal Express Checkout. Click Edit. Turn off the "Express Checkout Shortcut Button" option. Save.

[DivaVocals]

I do have an account at newegg because I did allot of business with them and it's very handy to look at past orders, even look up discontinued items I bought long ago to find details I forgot now like what CPU's a system board can use.
Most stores I will not even make an account at all, and rarely if ever for a first order!
So I do not want to force accounts with my store.
I know people like me will just say heck with it and leave the store and not buy anything before we will make an account at a unknown store.
If I see I am happy with a store and that I will be buying from them often then I may make an account and use it.

You may not have to create an "account" but you do have to provide BILLING and SHIPPING information.. so despite the fact that you are not making them create a username with a password, they do in fact have to provide the following information for ANY online store selling PHYSICAL merchandise:

• Name
• Address (for shipping and credit card verification purposes)
• email address (to facilitate all sales related communications)

Now I cannot speak for stores outside the US, but for LEGIT USA based businesses, you still have to collect this minimal information if you are selling virtual products for TAX purposes..

My point?? Folks make a REALLY big deal about not making customers create an account. Truth is that with some mods to some of the checkout language, the addition of some mods to help make the process a little more transparent (like Minimum Customer Account Information, Order Steps and COWOA which bundles in Order Steps), the so-called "issues" associated with checking out with an account are pretty much non-issues.. IJS..

[DivaVocals]

I'm not sure about the Express Checkout, what it actually does or how it works, what it effects.

Clearly.. The behavior you describe IS how the "Express Checkout Shortcut" feature of PayPal Express works.. Since PAYPAL is not calculating the shipping it HAS to take you back to the store after you log in to get the shipping calc and THEN return you to PayPal for completing the payment transaction.. This isn't a ZEN CART thing it's how the "Express Checkout Shortcut" feature of PayPal Express works. DrByte told you how to turn this off.. (quoted again below) Once you turn off the "Express Checkout Shortcut" featurefolks will go through the normal checkout process.. If you REALLY wnat them to not HAVE to create an account, then install COWOA or FEC..

Easy: Go to Admin->Modules->Payment->PayPal Express Checkout. Click Edit. Turn off the "Express Checkout Shortcut Button" option. Save.