Australia Post Shipping Module - Multiple Dispatch Locations

[HeyIts007]

Thanks for that advice Dave. I will consider it as one path toward a solution. As mentioned, I'm simply a product reseller and my manufacturers could be anywhere in Australia and dispatch from anywhere in Australia. At this stage, I only sell in Australia. I'm a little surprised ZenCart is not set up for this situation.

I'm fairly new to ZenCart so I'm speculating quite a bit about possible solutions to this.

I think a simple ZenCart fix could be to simply add a Post_Code field to the ZenCart MySQL manufacturers_info table and add a form data entry / edit field for that column.

That way any 3rd party shipping module could then look up the manufacturers_info table via a MySQL query against the products table using the manufacturers_id extracted from the products table.

Instead of using the one Dispatch PostCode, any 3rd party module would then use the product manufacturers_info table's new Post_Code field.

It could be made even more elaborate allowing a manufacturer to have multiple dispatch postcodes, that can then be selected by drop list for each product in the product setup. That way each product can be dispatched from a different dispatch location if need be and the dispatch location changed as needed. Or alternatively simply store one dispatch post code with each product. I actually like that idea as it gives total control over the products dispatch location on a per product basis.

However until such a mod is made, I will have to rely on what's available.

Yes have thought about a shipping cost averaging approach, by using NSW as a virtual dispatch point, even though the product actually might ship from anywhere around OZ.

Not quite ready to allow the customer to choose the price manually, however a another cross checking routine, could cross check the customer address post code, against their shipping post code selected, to see if they are trying to fiddle the system and reject a selection that does not match. i.e. if their shipping address is at 3001 Melbourne, but they enter 2001 Sydney for a product coming from Brisbane at 4001.

Still deciding on how to tackle it.

[RodG]

I think a simple ZenCart fix could be to simply add a Post_Code field to the ZenCart MySQL manufacturers_info table and add a form data entry / edit field for that column.

At first glance this seems like a good idea.

However, it all falls apart if you have more than one item in the cart from two different manufacturers with different shipping locations.

Any suggestions on how this could/should be handled?

It could be made even more elaborate allowing a manufacturer to have multiple dispatch postcodes, that can then be selected by drop list for each product in the product setup. That way each product can be dispatched from a different dispatch location if need be and the dispatch location changed as needed. Or alternatively simply store one dispatch post code with each product. I actually like that idea as it gives total control over the products dispatch location on a per product basis.

This also falls apart if more than one dispatch location is needed for any given order.

In theory, it would be possible to step through the cart items to sort via dispatch postcode then obtain multiple quotes and add them all together, but giving 'feedback' to the merchant as to how the quote was actually derived will be a difficult task, not to mention presenting the various options to the customer... eg, what if item '1' from manufacturer 'A' will fit into a 500gm satchel, but this manufacturer doesn't use satchels? and what if item#2 from manufacturer 'B' also fits this satchel, and item#3 from manufacturer 'C' fits a 3kg Satchel and the customer buys items 2 & 3, how can the module(s) present both options (one for each manufacturer) to the customer to select from?
How about if one item can fit a satchel, but the others require parcel rates.. again, presenting these options from a mixed cart will be so overly complex (and confusing to the customer) that it will have a detrimental impact.

However until such a mod is made, I will have to rely on what's available.

If it were as simple as you first suggested it would be a trivial thing to add, but clearly you have failed to take multiple items in the same cart into account.

Still deciding on how to tackle it.

I'm happy to take note of any suggestions you may have regarding the multiple item problem, but I have pondered on this one on and off for a couple of years now and it always ends up in the 'too hard' basket.

Cheers
Rod

[HeyIts007]

Yes I can see it can turn into a more complex problem, something I best avoid at this stage. Though the current ZenCart system seems very limited in respect of multiple shipping dispatch locations, all I need is the dispatch post code to roughly calculate the shipping cost.

Any unfavourable inaccuracies can be covered by sufficient product pricing margin and or conservative approximations on packing weight and dimensions. A shipping dispatch postcode in the product table suits me fine. The shipping cost estimation module then just refers to that dispatch post code for each product being shipped.

The current shipping by weight only limitation can be managed for now, with a more accurate weight and dimension field facilitation hopefully implemented in ZenCart down the track that upgraded / modified modules like Aust Post can plug into.

The packaging type is a separate issue I have not factored in on this occasion, as it's less significant for me at present. My prime focus is the shipping dispatch postcode. I would thus re-visit this along with package dimensions eventually and simply consult with each manufacturer on that issue.

I think much of the complexity can be hidden from the customer, by some programming and limiting display options, at a small sacrifice in optimal customised product shipping pricing, based on weight, dimension and packaging types. Thus yes definitely a few challenges, but quite achievable within my desired parameters.

Anyway one step at a time will get closer to the desired result.

[HeyIts007]

I think the big challenge is optimised packaging solutions for multiple products shipped as one package ( say 3 different products of different dimensions etc... , from one dispatch point, but again that's a challenge further away for me. Shipping products as separate packages seems fairly straightforward, even though not always cost optimal.

In my case I'm simply allowing the manufacturer to decide on appropriate packaging per order, which is factored into the cost, based on separate product packaging. Aust Post or whomever then just ship it. As typically multiple packages might be more expensive, it's covered at the outset. Combined packaging where cost effective then becomes a cost bonus.

Although that might not be an optimal solution cost wise, my main concern is the shipping cost based on the packaging type used, calculated on a per product basis. The finer granularity of cost calculation would be something to aspire toward, in the cases where it’s deemed to be worth the effort as one approaches the point of diminishing returns of cost versus time and effort.

[ozprodrivers]

I don't want you to take this personally but have a real good look at your overall operation. If you are selling heaps of items then making your own module to do what you want will warrant the cost.
Everyone including me way back wanted everything automated and sleek and nice and blah and blah.
Then I woke up and used the KISS theory and to date our ZC site 4 years down the track is still stable and working nicely.

Yes it would be good to have it all automated but one thing is you loose the feel for what is going on. You can't sit back and expect the world to keep pumping sales into you. To keep the sales coming in you have to work your shop.

Just to give you an idea Zencart is a one size fits all solution shopping cart. Modules like ozpost, MIGS, and a small number of others will allow a Zencart site to operate nicely within the borders of Aus. Everything is developed under the GNU system etc and then the module maybe placed into the freebee area of this site for everyone to use. At some stage you have to put your hand in the pocket as some folk require payment for their efforts or to do your own special thing you will definitely have to

You will find that not one shopping cart will be designed to be used in our market but the established ones like ZC and OSC are all stable and with some massaging will do what you want.

I forgot to mention the multi supplier orders for one customer, Thanks Rod. It becomes complex and somewhere along the way you will not be able to recover your freight so it is best to average it over the items.
The customer doesn't care how you supply it so long as it is in good nick when it gets to them and this is where it has potential to fall in a heap. Not one of your suppliers will work to a standard when it comes to packaging as we have experienced.
There is room for freight damage, lost parcels and late deliveries.
The general public especially ebay buyers know when a supplier is jacking the freight rate up to make a few more pennies.

With the ozpost module it allows the customer to choose the methods of dispatch so long as you have the correct weight and size in each items descriptions.
The module will then look at the item and list the methods based on what you allow to be used in the module admin.

Again if a customer can get away with keeping the cost down they will. We use to send 1m long scale model trucks in the post uninsured and non registered based on the customers choice... Not any more
Hope this all helps you as freight is a complex side of any shopping cart site.

We have the benefit of having our own ZC site and also develop the odd one now and then. We can place our own knowledge into a site.
What we have found is you have a fine line to walk between techo gurus and actual hands on experience. When we first kicked off the focus was on Google Page Rank, prominence and Key Words. Lot of sweat for really little result. Now it is about traffic no matter where it comes from or how you get it.
It is a whole different ball game and what is on our side in Aus is the shopping cart scene is not crowded like in the US where you actually have to be precise to get runs on the board.

Hope that this all helps
Cheers
Dave

[RodG]

Yes I can see it can turn into a more complex problem, something I best avoid at this stage.

There is no such thing as a simple solution to a complex problem, and anyone that says otherwise is wrong.

Though the current ZenCart system seems very limited in respect of multiple shipping dispatch locations, all I need is the dispatch post code to roughly calculate the shipping cost.

You have already dictated what you need and repeating it doesn't solve any of the issues that I raised.

Any unfavourable inaccuracies can be covered by sufficient product pricing margin and or conservative approximations on packing weight and dimensions.

Again, this doesn't address any of the issues I raised.

A shipping dispatch postcode in the product table suits me fine.

Well good for you. I sure wish you took note of the issues I raised though.

The shipping cost estimation module then just refers to that dispatch post code for each product being shipped.

OK, there is a solution that will fill your needs AND it adheres to the KISS principle.

Simply put, since you wish each item to be quoted separately you need to be using the 'Per Item" shipping method.

https://www.zen-cart.com/tutorials/i...hp?article=208

It won't/doesn't take dispatch postcodes into account because it really doesn't need to.. as long as you know the approx postage cost for any given item it won't matter which items from which manufacturer are placed in the cart the individual quotes will simply be added and presented to the customer.

The current shipping by weight only limitation can be managed for now, with a more accurate weight and dimension field facilitation hopefully implemented in ZenCart down the track

Whilst I agree this could be useful, the fact is, the modules that are dimensionally dependent, such as the ozpost and canada post modules (and others) already add these fields to the products database.

My prime focus is the shipping dispatch postcode.

Correction.... you may state this is your prime focus, but in reality you don't give a damn about the dispatch postcode, all you really care about is how much any given *item* is going to cost.

I think much of the complexity can be hidden from the customer, by some programming and limiting display options, at a small sacrifice in optimal customised product shipping pricing, based on weight, dimension and packaging types. .

Again you have ignored the realities of this proposal, such as what if there are multiple items from multiple manufactures in the cart? What if the manufacturers all use different shipping methods requiring different quotes for similar sized objects? Like it or not these issues must be addressed if you hope to have an 'automated' system.

If you can't or won't address these issues, then the 'per item' shipping method is going to be your best option by far....

Thus yes definitely a few challenges, but quite achievable within my desired parameters.
.

As a developer I have to state that your 'desired parameters' needs more detail as to expected behaviour when multiple items are placed in the cart.

Anyway one step at a time will get closer to the desired result.

A long long time ago, in my ignorance about the complexities of shipping/packaging modules I took up the challenge of creating a module that would provide optimum quotes from a *single* supplier regardless of the number of items added to the cart... (something a lot simpler than what you are hoping for)... after several years evolution the code was getting so complex, with more and more issues being discovered as I went, that I eventually trashed all I'd done and reverted back to the much simpler methods currently employed by ozpost (and the latest releases of the now obsolete 'AustPost'. During development I discovered that I was attempting to achieve what is considered to be 'the holy grail of shipping/packaging modules' (Do a google search)

It seems to me that you are not only asking for this 'holy grail' but you wish to combine several of them, one for each dispatch postcode.

You are going to have a VERY LONG wait.

Meanwhile, in my opinion the per item quote method is still probably going to be the best for your needs, assuming you really DO want a cost per product as has been indicated.

Cheers
Rod

[HeyIts007]

Thanks for the advice guys. Clearly there are limitations in ZenCart and I expect with most shopping carts. The multi items multi manufacturers freight estimation looks like one key issue here. The packaging dimensions freight estimation input limitation another key issue. The per item method does not seem ideal either, but probably not a bad freight cost averaging method.

I have set the zone to NSW to get some kind of freight cost averaging happening, as I see my main markets being on the east coast. I've also tweaked the shipping / packaging added percentage weight settings. I've cross checked it against my manufacturers shipping costs and am now getting costs close enough to pass. I can review that when the need arises.

For now I'm keeping it simple. Most of Zencart is working very well for me. I can deal with these more complex issues down the track when required. It's early days yet.

[ozprodrivers]

A small trick if you are bordering on the cutoff point from one rate to another. Just add a little bit more size and weight in your admin page per item to get you over the border. It will help.

Just another point we have our site set up to send the suppliers an invoice for the customer, a packing slip for the supplier records and an address label.
Our drop ship suppliers know they are not to add in any of their own documentation or promotional fliers. It is OK if the supplier plays the game but some don't. I am sure you will know about this.
Good Luck

[HeyIts007]

Thanks for that advice. I'm still navigating the supplier negations. I don't have much say over suppliers and I'm not in any position to argue with them. I'm just happy to sell their products at this stage. The business is basically still in the formation phase of getting suppliers on board to use me as a reseller. I'm making mistakes along the way, but that's not unexpected. I just hope I don't repeat them. I'm still evolving my business model so I can avoid revisiting the problems I've so far observed.