Scared away from osCommerce but wonder about same issues here?

[stevesh]

Right on a lot of counts.

One of the things that cause Zencart to fall behind other programs when it comes to plugins is the fact that it is a specialized program. A lot more people use Joomla or Wordpress because they are suitable for many more uses.


If people here know that a given add-on won't work with the current release then that add-on should be on a secondary page, and only plug'n'play modules should be available for people who can't code but just want a shopping cart.

I'd agree with that. A section for "old mod - may require recoding" might be helpful.


This community is obviously large and very cordial, but aside from the developers of the core package it seems to be more oriented toward individuals getting what they want for their personal sites rather than real collaboration in the spirit of open-source.

That, I think, has more to do with ability than motivation. Much as I'd like to write mods (and I have several ideas for great ones) I just don't have the programming expertise.

On the other hand, there are things I can do, like assist newcomers here in the forums, and I make every effort. Also, (opens can of worms here) there are probably other things I could help out with, but the current devs don't seem to be as open to outside help as other OSS projects. Maintaining the mods area would be an example of something someone other than the 4 devs could help out with.

[Merlinpa1969]

This community is obviously large and very cordial, but aside from the developers of the core package it seems to be more oriented toward individuals getting what they want for their personal sites rather than real collaboration in the spirit of open-source.

"Necessity is the mother of invention",
I dont see any opensource projects that the community just sits and thinks up new and great ideas....
Someone wants or needs something,
then they either build it. or contract someone to build it....


then they so to themselves " Self, ( and self replies Yes ) I wonder if anyone else could use this" then it becomes a mod....

[Mark Kidd]

Maybe this is simpler than it seems. Why not enable something like ZC's review functionality for the downloads sections? That way if I discover that one of the less active mods is working perfectly with 1.3.8 then I can at least make it known. Or if one of the inactive mods needs a few changes, let the first brave soul who tries (and fails) to install it record their experience right where it is most relevant so that folks who need it to work out of the box won't needlessly repeat the experiment and maybe it will help the next person who decides to adopt the mod.

Support threads in the forums are great, but I think opening up a little bit of the listing to the community might do wonders for addressing the OP's points.

[gjh42]

That sounds like a good idea, but I think it would have to be carefully set up so the "reviews" don't end up being another support thread. Duplication in this case would be bad. A severe limit on length might help.

Maybe arranging a standard link to the latest post in a support thread (which link could be maintainable only by the mod author) would work. If a mod is relatively inactive, a post that "This works with v1.x.y" would stay visible.

[Mark Kidd]

Actually, I just discovered that there is a section of the Wiki for add-ons. Trouble is, the add-on pages don't link to the wiki! What about a prominent link on each add-on page, with a heading of something like "Read community documentation and contribute your comments about this add-on at the Zen Cart wiki."

Let the tools and the community work for itself, they're both already in place.

[CaptainStarbuck]

Thank you for the continuing positive discussion. I've installed ZC. No, it's not so simple that a monkey can do it, but in one evening I was able to create a highly personalized site even with the default theme, add categories and some products. The installation experience was pleasant and rewarding, though manually intensive.

Just as a quick example of why this wasn't a slam-dunk:
- Given some available time, one thing I'd do is write a script to reset all of the file permissions so that this doesn't need to be done manually on a new install. That's a silly distraction.
- Another thing I'd do is to create forms that allow the customization of all language specs, rather than having to go make manual changes to PHP files.

For me those things were easy, after I found notes here in the forum and in the tutorial (wonderful resource there!). But for someone without experience with file permissions or PHP coding, I cans see that these simple items could have killed the deal.

On the other side of that coin, anyone installing OSS packages like this to a website needs some basic level of competence. If they don't know enough to create a database, change permissions, or edit some text files, then they should probably be leaving this effort to someone with a clue. My desire to create helpful tools is balanced by the knowledge that there is only so much that can/should be done in certain areas.

I need to get out of the fire and back into the pan, but when I can find time I will write up some comments of the noob experience. This can be used to help other noobs or to point out areas for potential improvement by any of "us" who can find time.

I liked the idea of using ZC itself to allow review and download of various modules. As with any product comments I think the text should be moderated, not by biased developers but by a group of people who can ensure that the content remains accurate, informative, and free from site-specific issues that are better handled in the forum.

I haven't been around long enough to see any heavy-handedness on the part of the site managers but I'll keep an eye open for this.

In all fairness, the only other package I'm looking at now is Magento, but that has it's own little world of pros and cons and I intend to give ZC a fair shake before looking elsewhere.

Let the fun begin!

[sadie]

This is a very interesting topic. Zen-cart does work and it is very stable. It is the only shopping cart that I have ever used, after doing research on a lot of other carts (oscommerce, sunshop, cube cart, etc.). But, in my experience it is not easy for "everyone" to install, customize and get up and running. Even getting all of the text and box colors changed from the default install can be challenging and time consuming. I think that the ease of use depends on your own level of computer/programming skills and experience.

For many people, with little to no computer/programming skills and experience, it would save many headaches to pay someone to install and customize your zen-cart site for you. But, this can be expensive, so each person needs to make the decision whether they are willing to put the hours into their zen-cart store to get it and all of the add-ons working, or whether they want to pay for help.

Re: mods. I try to use as few as possible, I think five or so are installed, because for any open source project, you always run the risk of incompatibility when a new version comes out. That being said, most of the popular mods are maintained, and are updated when “major” new releases come out (such as zen-cart 1.2x to 1.3x). You can always search the forum for any mod you are looking into to see if it is compatible.

[jvanree]

I've built a store with zen cart, and it was the first store I've ever built. I had some html experience but no css and php experience. However the installing and adjustment of basic functions was easy. The upload of products very smooth. The add ons that are available for the version I work with (1.3.7) are working well, but if they need adjusting I get great support from people on the forum. Trough their support I've learned css almost completely and I'd say I'm halfway there with php. Most of the mods are compatible with multiple versions of zc or easely adjustable to be compatible.

I've tried oscommerce locally, but I have a hard time with it. Somehow it doesn't feel very complete and I'm having a way harder time working with it. I'm not nearly skilled enough to judge the entire shopsystem, but zc rules for me.

If I were you I would try and run both stores locally to see how they compare.

[Vger]

are paid by Harald

Now, let's not get silly. Harald doesn't pay anyone for anything

Vger

[rstar23]

Wanted to throw my 2 cents in here

I have been doing development a loooong time. During that time I have worked with many e-comm products including OSC and ZC.

In my own experience I found OSC to be a major pain in the rear if you were going to do anything other than run an out-of-the-box solution. Ho many of us have clients that want a vanilla solution?

ZC has been a treat to work with. 1.3.8a is stable, is well equipped as-is and is very easy to modify and add to.

Rich
Dogsoldier.com, LLC