Different prices for different countries

[arjuna]

My shop is based in Europe with prices in Euros.
I would still like to define my price manually in US$ for each product, not based on the conversion Euro-Dollar.
And the same for each currency. But creating clones shops for each currency seems to me too much work. Maybe it's not.
I have already a German and an English shop, because the pictures of my books and CDs need to be different.

[marianflorin]

Was this request implemented? I need to implement the exact same thing and I didn't find something useful, only the addons Dual Pricing and Group Pricing seem to be close to this feature.

[monkeshine]

Steven(S_Mack)
It isn't about being greedy.
For us, it's about stable pricing.

People who export know all too well that it is very hard to sell an item that retails for $10 in the USA for the exact same equivalency in local currencies. There are taxes, duties, shipping charges and other expenses involved in getting products abroad. If you are Coca Cola you can do it but most other companies end up with as much as 100% higher prices in some countries resulting from taxes, VAT, shipping and importation duties. An item made in the USA which is sold at retail for $10 in USA may cost $15 in Ireland and $20 in India because of all the extra costs. This is especially true for people who sell through brokers or wholesalers who in turn supply brick and mortar stores and only have web sales as a small fraction of their business, or as a convenience for those who cannot find it at brick and mortar.

So if possible, you would want to have prices based on location. This way if you do make a deal with an Irish importer and the product ends up selling for the equivalent of $15 in Euros, the price on your website will show the local price ($15 in Euros) and not a lower US dollar price. Customers in Ireland will get angry if they Google the currency converter and see that their local store is selling it for 50% more than the price sold by the company itself online. But if the online store also has it for 50% more then they would never know. They would have to log in to the USA site to see it.

Not sure if the new currency converter function I see in V1.5 will actually work by location, or if you have to log in and choose currency. I hope it is more or less automatic. That would save a lot of headaches. Another option is to clone your zencart and then have an IP direct to the site most relevant e.g. Europe, USA, Canada etc. It should be easier than that though. IP detection is more common - it has to be plausible. How about a script that simply modifies the price displayed (and charged) up or down based on the incoming IP address' country?

Good luck

[s_mack]

This debate has gone on for a long time. While there are obviously a lot of people that think its somehow wise to offer different prices to different customers based on location... I personally think its silly, and I don't see it being implemented officially just because of all the headaches that would cause and (undoubtedly) how difficult that would be to code.

As far as I can see, the *only* valid reason to show a different price for some over others is that some countries require VAT to be displayed in the price while others won't allow you to include taxes in the displayed price (others it is up to the merchant). Most shops that are required to show VAT just simply do so and say they are doing so, and then the VAT is removed from orders where it doesn't apply. As a Canadian customer shopping on a French website (for example), I admit it is a TINY bit confusing when I see a high price with VAT included and I'm always concerned they haven't coded it properly... but I'm always willing to go through their checkout to find out.

But as far as making a sucker out of some poor sod that is in a country that you decide should pay more for no good reason... that's a business decision of yours. Your customer's not an idiot... they'll find out that you're selling it overseas for less and they'll be sufficiently angry no matter how you try to mask it.

I'm in your shoes (I think). I sell my product world-wide. I'm in Canada but, like many, I base my prices in USD and I consider my US customers first simply because they are my largest market. But my international market is significant (its about 50% US, 5% Canadian, 45% worldwide). I have a Spanish distributor that marks up my items a lot for his local market. That's his call. I refuse to give him exclusive territory (that's my call) and I get direct Spanish orders all the time. Its no surprise that he sells at a MUCH lower rate than I do, even to his own country. But if I bend to his request and either refuse to sell to Spanish customers or I put his price on my site for his customers, then it negatively impacts my bottom line as well as these fine Spanish folks that shouldn't have to spend more than they want. The premise of having a local distributor is for the convenience and other benefits of things like language, etc. If the local distributor can't/won't sell at a competitive price, I don't see why the customer should be forced to chew on that. Let the customer decide where they want to buy from. If that means cutting out your distributors, then so be it! On the other hand, if you value your distributor so highly, then get distributors in the USA, raise your world wide price to protect all your distribtors, and let them sell at their desired price. My other business works like that. I have a very high-margin price displayed on my site for all to see. And I still get a remarkable number of direct sales (bonus for me), but there's more than enough room between that high retail price and my wholesale price for my distributors to make money selling at whatever they find appropriate for their markets.

It obviously depends on the product, the margins, etc etc. But don't confuse a technology with a business decision. Make the appropriate decision first and fit the technology second. I think if you consider it enough, you'll find there's no need to price differently for different markets, and you'll find it creates more problems than it solves, but if you insist... well, get coding! There's a lot of people that agree with you (or at least think they do).

- Steven

ps. I do respect that there might be a desire to show "round" numbers in various currencies from a visual perspective (ie. $10 USD and 12 Euro rather than $10 USD and 11,84 Euro. Or always have it end in an 88 or 99 or whatever) but then that doesn't really have anything to do with currencies, per-se, and should be done globally in the price output functions.

[monkeshine]

Your judgment about my business practice is totally unwarranted and wholly inaccurate. You do not know what I do, or understand what I am trying to do and I don't appreciate having to be put in a position to defend myself for things I don't do. I am not trying to gouge anyone. I am just trying to show prices that approximate the local price.

If I sell my widget to a US wholesaler, they sell it to a retailer who sells it to the end user. So it basically touches 2 hands before it reaches the end user in the US (and Canada for that matter).

When I sell my widget to my UK importer, I charge him 20% less than I charge a US wholesaler. But that 20% barely covers the shipping and importation duties. He has to cover other landing costs and his overhead. He then sells it to other regional wholesalers, (one in Liverpool, one in Sheffield, etc) who then sell it to their local retailers, who then sell to consumers. That is 3 mark-ups before the end-user buys it. I don't wish it so, but that is the way it is. That is the way this industry has developed its channels.

At a former company I invested $100,000's in disruptive technologies in the attempt to change this business model. I don't like the fact that there need to be 3-4 warehouses touching the goods before the end user gets them. That raises the costs obviously but it also means you lose speed, you lose quality control, goods may go stale or obsolete or not turn (rotate) correctly. If everyone could sell the same items in real time and have it shipped from centralized, efficient locations on their behalf it would mean lower costs for consumers and more profits for those in the channel. I build software that would allow the product to be fulfilled from one warehouse and allocate the sale and profits/commissions to many people in channel from distributors to importers to salesmen and even district and regional managers - reducing redundant expenses. But it is not easy to sell that change to people who have made their business and fed their families around buying and warehousing and reselling goods. You will see that as a threat to your livelihood. Your assets are not your warehouse. Your assets are your ability to sell, your relationships and your customer lists. Technology that hands that information over to the manufacturer is a threat to your existence. So while I tried and spent a fortune, all that investment went to naught, and I learned a valuable lesson the opposite of the one you are preaching here.

Anyway now I have my own company and sell my own goods inside this same channel I tried to disrupt. If you were my CFO and suggested I fire my distributors I would fire you. Please don't make assumptions about what I am trying to accomplish or what my needs are.

Anyway yes I know people are not stupid and they can go online and see the same item at Amazon for less, or at the online store of one of 1000's of B&M retailers. I can go online and order my product from websites in 20 different countries and find it at prices from 30% below MSRP to 40% above. That is not my point or desire. My point is, it is not wise to make your own distribution channel look bad by displaying prices that are 30%-40% below the local market prevailing price. My desire is I don't want to even appear to compete with the distribution channel I have cultivated. I just want to display prices that approximate the local price because there is nothing much I can do about how much the item costs in Norway or Russia or Turkey. So why should I fight it? <- that's a rhetorical question.

[monkeshine]

I re-read your post and want to retract the tone of my reply/ Some words you used stuck out more than others on my first reading and it is too late to edit my post. Anyway apologies if I came off too harsh in retort. I don't feel defensive about my decisions at all, probably just cranky and tired. This is probably a project I should hire someone to do, and ultimately will. I just like to learn as much as I can and am indeed learning a lot trying to build a custom showroom/store.

[s_mack]

No apologies needed... I've seen it before and we'll undoubtedly see it again. The more you explain it, the more I know I'm right. Your logic is flawed. Your stubbornly looking at it the way you're going to look at it, but the reality is that you're attempting to head down a path that is far too complicated to pull off with almost no reason to even attempt it. I suppose there might be a scenario where it would make sense, but now that you've explained it more... its obvious that your scenario is not one that requires what you think it is you want to do (you don't really want to do it, but you're obviously not going to see that).

Your last point makes my point exactly:

My point is, it is not wise to make your own distribution channel look bad by displaying prices that are 30%-40% below the local market prevailing price. My desire is I don't want to even appear to compete with the distribution channel I have cultivated.

I completely agree. Your not in any special situation. That's the same as any of us that sell in more than our home markets (which is pretty much all of us since this is the old interweb now, isn't it?). My answer to your "point" is simple... "don't". And you have two extremely simple ways to do that: #1 (the simplest) is don't sell online. Simply point customers to their nearest distributor. #2 is to price yourself high enough that you're not competing with your channel. That gives the customers who don't have representation and option (albeit an expensive one, but so what? That's what you're proposing anyway for at least some of them) and the ones that do have an option either pay for the convenience or get it from the local distributor who's cheaper.

Yeah yeah, your situation is completely unique and I just don't "get it". You're an extremely successful so-and-so who spent such and such on this and that and you fire CFOs (like you've got CanythingsOs... you wouldn't be looking at a free shopping cart if you did), etc etc... and I'm just some moron that can't possibly understand the intricacies of international trade as it relates to your particular widget. No, the fact is we're in the same bloody shoes. I've just been in mine a bit longer and have advice to pass onto you. And really, it has nothing to do with your business but just basic logic: MANY people have asked to do what you asked; They ALL get told its not a great idea; NONE of them have ignored that advice and come back with a contribution that does what you want. Reason? ITS NOT A GOOD IDEA. Its far more complicated than its worth and when you get done throwing good money after the bad idea, you'll scrap it when your customers and your distributors start complaining until your ears bleed.

Good luck though :) I'm at home sick, so I had this wonderful opportunity for our exchange. I'm getting better (finally) so back to work soon. No more lovely chats.

[monkeshine]

[QUOTE=s_mack;1170071 My answer to your "point" is ... price yourself high enough that you're not competing with your channel. That gives the customers who don't have representation and option (albeit an expensive one, but so what? That's what you're proposing anyway for at least some of them) and the ones that do have an option either pay for the convenience or get it from the local distributor who's cheaper.[/QUOTE]

Funny that you spent several posts arguing against an option you yourself propose as a viable alternative.

Maybe you meant, price it high enough in US dollars and not worry about foreign currencies? If so, seems to me to be a distinction without a difference.

[monkeshine]

Yeah yeah, your situation is completely unique and I just don't "get it". You're an extremely successful so-and-so who spent such and such on this and that and you fire CFOs (like you've got CanythingsOs... you wouldn't be looking at a free shopping cart if you did), etc etc... and I'm just some moron that can't possibly understand the intricacies of international trade as it relates to your particular widget.

I don't understand why you feel the need to take the conversation to this level, with sarcasm to boot. What do you really know about what I am doing? Why would you make any assumptions at all?

Maybe I am a hands-on manager of my own business who is bidding out a project and has received a range of bids to accomplish X, Y and Z tasks on A, B or C platforms, and while admittedly not an expert I am not completely illiterate when it comes to this stuff either, I have decided to do my due diligence to see what value I would actually be getting, what options exist, and which of the bids seem reasonable given what is available?

What does the price of ZenCart (and the add-ons?) have to do with it? Maybe I received a couple of proposals to use ZC as a platform, along with UltraCart and Volution as hosted back-end solutions to various front end "shops", and take it upon myself to see what each can do, what each can offer, where each is strong and weak and compare them against the proposals? It seems bizarre to denigrate the platform you have written mods to improve simply because its free, but beyond that anyone doing this task would be wise to kick the tires and see what capabilities exist and what value they bring, and what price they are worth paying for.

You seem like a bright guy, I don't understand why you think anyone is attacking you personally when they have a different view, nor why you jump to conclusions about who, what, or why I say and ask the things I do. You want to believe there is a universal method of doing things fine, God speed and I appreciate the viewpoint (and on this point wish you would be more elaborative because I think you do have some experience that would be beneficial to myself and others). But I find the personal side of your replies to be really bizarre, and your assumptions are completely off base.

But hey, glad you are feeling better. Thanks for your help.

[jojkic]

I have some problem.
I need two different prices for two different currency.
For default language: Serbian, one price in RSD , and for selling on local market
and when language is change to English , other price in Euro (or Dollar) , for selling on European (world market) .
It is very hard to I explain here to someone who live in USA or similar, why I need two prices per product, that I need to enter them manual (euro and rsd price), without using currency converter in zen cart , it is not only "nice" round numbers in price display , it is also situation that different product have different cost (sale tax, customs tax and other administration things) or that some specific products need to be cheaper on world market then on local market etc .... Simply say, different zones, different economy = different prices , that I need update manual without using currency converter , for every product separate .
Of course I do not need to hide prices. Everyone who change language in header, can see this different prices in different currency

Can someone have solution idea ?