ozpost shipping module

uniqueliving:

. Why dont you just charge out at a hourly rate for support like other people do.

If this is directed at me I can give many reasons for this. Firstly, this is working under the assumption that all the coding to be done has already been done and paid for. In other words, I'll only be getting paid hourly by those that need my support, and are willing to pay a reasonably rate from now, and in the future.

Secondly, all the work done over the last 3 years (lets say 3000 hours coding) has provided a stable, low maintenence code that only a handful of people have problems installing, and after that it can be pretty much forgotten.
Low maintence means once installed, few people ever need support.

I reckon if I left the original long broken austpost code as it was, over the last few years I could have made a small fortune charging each and every user for 'support' to fix it (well at least til someone else came along and fixed it so that individual support was no longer needed)

Low maintence also means no adjustments required when the postage rates change. I do this on the server... the clients (users) always get the latest prices, so I can't charge an hourly rate for that kind of support.. unlike the earlier code (recently re-released) which has many of the rates 'hard coded' which means manual updates for someone.
I'll wager a lot of people opting to use that copy will ultimately end up paying someone else more than I'm asking just to keep it updated .. what with Austrlia Post changing prices of some thing at least twice in the last 12 months

So, to sum up, it is because I have done such a good job on things that trying to survive with providing hourly support isn't a practical solution. This is a case of people paying for the support and service that they DON'T see.. (until there is a problem of course, then all hell breaks loose with people telling me how much I've cost them in lost sales revenue).
What The!!!

All of the above is still ignoring all the work that has already gone into the project.
I've no idea how much a contracter will charge to re-create what I've already done, but if the 100 or so active zencart merchants each put in a couple of hundred I'm sure you may get something on par... but even then it will be stagnant... the contracter won't provide free updates and free support. Well, not unless you pay another few hundred each.
I'll also add at this point that most of the features made to ozpost beyond the 'basic functionality has been added at the request of other people, not for our own use or benefit.

Anyway, what HAS already been done isn't an issue, I had never planned to make money, or even recouperate anything for my time spent ion the project so far... What I would like to do is ensure that I'm in a position where I'm capable of continuing the development and maintenance of both the client code and the servers in the future.. Hourly support doesn't allow this, unless I make the code a bit more unreliable, or difficult to install (Note how ozpost doesn't require you to run sql scripts, unlike most addons?), oh, and I'll need to stop doing price updates on the server too, I could easily charge $60 or more per customer up to twice a year for doing this.

My only other comment is that Australia doesn't have the numbers that would allow me to consider a lesser annual fee (not by any significant amount). Think about it... on the outside I am only going to get 30-50 people to subsrcribe.. (Based on current takeup rate)... that's what, $500p/m tops. I typically spend 2 hrs a day with the zencart forums, and 4 or 5 hours per day doing other ozpost related things... seems to me that I'm still grossly underpaying myself
And alas, these numbers aren't sustainable either, which is why I also need to tap into the market for other ecommerce stores.

Finally, if this was your way of telling me to 'get a job' all I can say is I wish I could... Australia has a big issue with 'ageism' (acknowledged by the changes to centerlink requirements for 55y/os). In the last 9 months I have applied for a little over 200 positions, ranging from fulltime, parttime, casual, contract, and voluntary, from help desk to security consultant. In the last 4 years I have applied for will over 400 jobs, and during that time I put myself through TAFE to 'prove' I had the required skills to potential employers... this cost me over $10k in fees (in spite of being subsidised by the goverment)..... pretty much cleaned out our bank account and still no job, so why shouldn't I turn to those that I've been working for (for nothing) for the last few years (zencart merchants) and 'ask' them to help me survive the future, thus ensuring the future of the software that they count on?

From the impression/reaction I have recieved from some people (not necessarlly you) there is a perception that there are a 1000+ people using zencart/ozpost and I stand to be making $100,000 per year from it.. Yeah, I wish....... If there were 1000 of us, I'd only ask $10 per year, and we'd all be happy :-)

Regards
Rod

RodG:

If this is directed at me I can give many reasons for this. Firstly, this is working under the assumption that all the coding to be done has already been done and paid for. In other words, I'll only be getting paid hourly by those that need my support, and are willing to pay a reasonably rate from now, and in the future.

Secondly, all the work done over the last 3 years (lets say 3000 hours coding) has provided a stable, low maintenence code that only a handful of people have problems installing, and after that it can be pretty much forgotten.
Low maintence means once installed, few people ever need support.

I reckon if I left the original long broken austpost code as it was, over the last few years I could have made a small fortune charging each and every user for 'support' to fix it (well at least til someone else came along and fixed it so that individual support was no longer needed)

Low maintence also means no adjustments required when the postage rates change. I do this on the server... the clients (users) always get the latest prices, so I can't charge an hourly rate for that kind of support.. unlike the earlier code (recently re-released) which has many of the rates 'hard coded' which means manual updates for someone.
I'll wager a lot of people opting to use that copy will ultimately end up paying someone else more than I'm asking just to keep it updated .. what with Austrlia Post changing prices of some thing at least twice in the last 12 months

So, to sum up, it is because I have done such a good job on things that trying to survive with providing hourly support isn't a practical solution. This is a case of people paying for the support and service that they DON'T see.. (until there is a problem of course, then all hell breaks loose with people telling me how much I've cost them in lost sales revenue).
What The!!!

All of the above is still ignoring all the work that has already gone into the project.
I've no idea how much a contracter will charge to re-create what I've already done, but if the 100 or so active zencart merchants each put in a couple of hundred I'm sure you may get something on par... but even then it will be stagnant... the contracter won't provide free updates and free support. Well, not unless you pay another few hundred each.
I'll also add at this point that most of the features made to ozpost beyond the 'basic functionality has been added at the request of other people, not for our own use or benefit.

Anyway, what HAS already been done isn't an issue, I had never planned to make money, or even recouperate anything for my time spent ion the project so far... What I would like to do is ensure that I'm in a position where I'm capable of continuing the development and maintenance of both the client code and the servers in the future.. Hourly support doesn't allow this, unless I make the code a bit more unreliable, or difficult to install (Note how ozpost doesn't require you to run sql scripts, unlike most addons?), oh, and I'll need to stop doing price updates on the server too, I could easily charge $60 or more per customer up to twice a year for doing this.

My only other comment is that Australia doesn't have the numbers that would allow me to consider a lesser annual fee (not by any significant amount). Think about it... on the outside I am only going to get 30-50 people to subsrcribe.. (Based on current takeup rate)... that's what, $500p/m tops. I typically spend 2 hrs a day with the zencart forums, and 4 or 5 hours per day doing other ozpost related things... seems to me that I'm still grossly underpaying myself
And alas, these numbers aren't sustainable either, which is why I also need to tap into the market for other ecommerce stores.

Finally, if this was your way of telling me to 'get a job' all I can say is I wish I could... Australia has a big issue with 'ageism' (acknowledged by the changes to centerlink requirements for 55y/os). In the last 9 months I have applied for a little over 200 positions, ranging from fulltime, parttime, casual, contract, and voluntary, from help desk to security consultant. In the last 4 years I have applied for will over 400 jobs, and during that time I put myself through TAFE to 'prove' I had the required skills to potential employers... this cost me over $10k in fees (in spite of being subsidised by the goverment)..... pretty much cleaned out our bank account and still no job, so why shouldn't I turn to those that I've been working for (for nothing) for the last few years (zencart merchants) and 'ask' them to help me survive the future, thus ensuring the future of the software that they count on?

From the impression/reaction I have recieved from some people (not necessarlly you) there is a perception that there are a 1000+ people using zencart/ozpost and I stand to be making $100,000 per year from it.. Yeah, I wish....... If there were 1000 of us, I'd only ask $10 per year, and we'd all be happy :-)

Regards
Rod

Hi Rod

Understand a bit better where your coming from now as I have been stuck on the centrelink thing for years after a accident left me permanently disable at no fault of my own there was no compo or anything and i basically lost everything i had. Since then i started the shopping carts and gradually grew a bit bigger and opened a retail shop which enabled me to create a job of my own. If i had a job for you you would have it. I,m sure there are more than 30 or 40 zencarts out there, the problem I have is that i have 8 carts and @ $5 per cart it adds up when the carts aren't doing that well with not as many people spending at the moment. I can't afford to spend $40 per month on this.

Also Rod is supplying and maintaining a server to run the module. He is not just supplying code and support.
I think the best option would have been if you had charged right from the beginning! Then people wouldn't think it is their right to get it for free. Hindsight....

robbie269:

I think the best option would have been if you had charged right from the beginning! Then people wouldn't think it is their right to get it for free. Hindsight....

The osCommerce users of the module have only ever had the paid version, and yes, you are correct, not one of them has expected a free version to be thier 'right'. Other carts will also only ever know of a paid version.

However, I stress that there never was any plans or intention to charge for the service/support ever, so it isn't like this scenario has been caused by a lack of foresight... I'd have done many things different over the years if that were the case.. eg, better auditing, better merchant feedback for pending expirations, automated registrations , and so on

If I should happen to come into money from other sources, and still have time available for ongoing support/development I'd revert back to the free system faster than you could say 'refund' - Seriously, I get a LOT more satisfaction form working with and helping people for free than I ever could by charging (even though it may not always appear that way).

Anyway, I agree hindsight is a wonderful thing. Lets hope the system does 'survive', because it would be sad if in a few years the servers (and I) go away and people start saying 'In hindsight, we really should have supported the service, because now it isn't even an option.

Cheers, and thanks for your supportive comments
Rod

thanks for quick fix :D and will be doing subscription once the sites are ready.

I will let u know if i find any issues.

Hello,

We just setup a TNT account, it said the price checker will take 1 or 2 days to be approved

I am able to login to TNT ONLINE @ http://www.tnt.com/express/en_au/site/home.html with the TNTuser / TNTpassword which redirects to **http://www.tntexpress.com.au/interaction/asps/frame.asp**, **
but I cant get into my.tnt,** admin said they use this but I dont know what it is

Ozpost error log:

Server Returned TNT0.00-1The account number supplied is invalid or not assigned to this login.RPXXX.X02 Regular ParcelREG19.853Registered ParcelRPPi21.203Insured ParcelCOD27.403Cash On DeliveryEXP47.451 Express ParcelEXPi51.751 Insured Express 4.30 2.95 CLARINDA SYDNEY 3

Or other test said

TNT0.00-1The account number supplied is invalid or not assigned to this login.PPxxxx.102 5kg Prepaid Satchel ExpressRPP21.305 Regular ParcelREG24.256Registered ParcelCOD31.806Cash On DeliveryRPPi32.356Insured ParcelEXP57.852 Express ParcelEXPi68.902 Insured Express 11.05 2.95 EAST WICKEPIN SYDNEY 1084

We used the right login info....

Rod, I brought this up once before, but think I need the hack:

ego.com.au shows 0 days delivery for all but the most remote areas of OZ, so where can I change the 0 to always be 1?

I realise this isn't the optimum approach, but if it is a server thing, I would rather at least a human figure so people opt for this service.

It leaves the other services for dead and I want to encourage it! (I mean with my customers - suppliers probably already know how much easier it is to book, pay for and use. And usually cheaper...)

vandiermen:

Hello,

We just setup a TNT account, it said the price checker will take 1 or 2 days to be approved

I am able to login to TNT ONLINE @ http://www.tnt.com/express/en_au/site/home.html with the TNTuser / TNTpassword which redirects to **http://www.tntexpress.com.au/interaction/asps/frame.asp**, **
but I cant get into my.tnt,** admin said they use this but I dont know what it is

Ozpost error log:

Server Returned TNT0.00-1The account number supplied is invalid or not assigned to this login.

Or other test said

TNT0.00-1The account number supplied is invalid or not assigned to this login.
We used the right login info....

The TNT site is a nigtmare to navigate - too many different logons for various services.

First and most important, it needs a valid TNT account for the 'RTT' service. The error messages are suggesting that this is the problem, the account itself is valid, but NOT for this particular service.

I can tell the username/password provided were correct because these are the first things checked (if incorrect we are informed of this before it procedes to check the account number), so what we have are valid user credentials but not for the service being requested.

We require the "RTT" or 'Rated Transit Times' service, this needs to be created at 'TNT Online' and** it requires a phone call to the CIT
Helpdesk on 1300 851 131 for the service be enabled for the account.

**For some strange reason it doesn't seem possible for TNT to set up a user account, a TNT online account AND the RTT service at the same time, but it really is three distinctly separate accounts that need setting.

Hope this helps?
Cheers
Rod

tpeck:

Rod, I brought this up once before, but think I need the hack:

ego.com.au shows 0 days delivery for all but the most remote areas of OZ, so where can I change the 0 to always be 1?

I realise this isn't the optimum approach, but if it is a server thing,

Yoiks, I thought I'd fixed that @ the server ages ago. I'll take another look into it ASAP (next day or two at most )

tpeck:

It leaves the other services for dead and I want to encourage it! (I mean with my customers - suppliers probably already know how much easier it is to book, pay for and use. And usually cheaper...)

I've noticed their (e-go.com.au) prices are always considerably cheaper than the competition, but until a few weeks ago I'd not even heard of them.It's good to find more than one person finds 'em useful.

Cheers
Rod

tpeck:

ego.com.au shows 0 days delivery for all but the most remote areas of OZ, so where can I change the 0 to always be 1?.

Should be fixed now.... For some reason I'd commented out the line where I'd fixed it before (probably got sidetracked with phone call or sumthing).

FYI, The 0 days were being reported intead of "Overnight". My fix is/was to replace 'Overnight' with the number #1 - That way, the shipping days offset will still function.
Problem now is, I can't seem to find any locations where it doesn't report "Overnight" so hopefully I haven't inadvertantly broken something else.

Cheers
Rod

You beaut! That's fixed it.

I too hope you haven't inadvertently broken the overnight thingy, but overnight still registers 1 day in my feeble brain!

tpeck:

overnight still registers 1 day in my feeble brain!

Mine too!

How come no one ever offfers 'overday' shipping? :smile:

Cheers
Rod

I received notice of this change today. I go on holidays tomorrow.

As Ozpost was working correctly on my checks, and the module itself gave no alert, I had no reason to visit this thread.

Your change has put me in a very difficult position. Pay the hostage fee and lose even more money, or go with the default shipping, and just lose money.

I am already close enough to having to fold. Thanks for the module, but I will not be switching to the subscription. I'm already running at a loss, I can't add another.

The alternatives? Don't. Work.

Dvixen:

I received notice of this change today..

At least you did recieve notice. A few of the more unfortunate users who's expiry was last week didn't get any notice. As a result I suspended the automatic expirations as soon as I realised that it was probably doing more harm than good. You, and many others, have had at least a week extension until I was able to track you down via Google searches (basically this the only method I have of contacting users not yet subscribed).

I've found all but five of the currently active zencart/ozpost users (127 active @ Sept 20th 2010).

Did any of us realise that we were so few numbers?

Perhaps we should form a committee ;-)

Cheers
Rod

Hi Rod

I hope this hasn't already been covered but after 122 pages of replies its easy to overlook......Anyway just downloaded and installed 2.0.9. We use both Aus Post and Fastways for delivies currently.

We have found however that peopleget put of by shipping costs in Australia and use a practice of building in a component of the shipping cost into the product which then gives free shipping to most east coast capitals. Out business rarely sells multiple items in a single transaction. For remote areas then the shipping cost is discounted by the amount "built in" the price.

I want to use your module rather then the other Fastway shipping module due to the issues with different costs for different suburbs within a post code.....and having to maintain this database. To fit I thought of using a negative handling fee for Aus post and Fast Way Labels however when you do this it removes that option from the result. (woudl also like it to return $0 if the calculated cost via the module is less then what I put int he handling fee as a negative number).

Is this possible and am I missing a config option ?

Thanks

Stumps

Stumpy74:

I hope this hasn't already been covered

No. This is a first.

Stumpy74:

To fit I thought of using a negative handling fee for Aus post and Fast Way Labels however when you do this it removes that option from the result.

I can't think why it should... I've no reason to deny negative amounts.

Stumpy74:

(woudl also like it to return $0 if the calculated cost via the module is less then what I put int he handling fee as a negative number).

Is this possible and am I missing a config option ?

It should be possible (he says cautiously), and no, you haven't missed a config option.......

Handy with a text editor?
load /includes/modules/shipping/ozpost.php into editor

At or near line 467 you'll see:

```

if ( (($quote->cost > 0) && ($handlingFee >= 0)) ) { // valid quote

Alter this line so it reads: 

if ( (($quote->cost > 0) && ($handlingFee[B] != -1[/B])) ) { // valid quote

 
Save the file, then enter your negative handling fees.. use ANY value except -1   

As for returning to $0 ...  the line that follows the one just edited is a simple formula that adds the shipping and handling figures, so add another line after that that reads something like 

if ($cost < 0 ) $cost = 0 ;   

... resave the file and give it a try.   

Cheers
Rod

Thats great thanks Rod. Working like a charm. Going to register for the server during the week after a bit more tinkering.......

out of interest will this mod work its way into core code or will I need to fix for each release ?

Thanks again

Stumps
Adorable Baby Cakes
https://www.adorablebabycakes.com.au

Stumpy74:

Thats great thanks Rod. Working like a charm.
<snip>
will this mod work its way into core code or will I need to fix for each release ?

I'll fix it in the core code, albeit, in a somewhat different manner. What I've given you is what we in the trade call a 'kludge' ... it get's the job done, but it's nothing to be proud of.

Cheers
Rod

G'day Guys and Gals,

I've been have a good chat with a friendly fellow at TNT today as a result of some/several people having issues getting the TNT quotes to work.

I/we have identified several 'common' problems.

1. Having a TNT account is not enough. You MUST request the RTT service to be enabled.

2. Passwords are limited to 14 characters - This is confusing because if you enter longer passwords on the website they are accepted just fine, but if you use a password revealing utility it can be seen that anything over 14 characters are truncated ... However, they are NOT truncated when used via the quote scripts, so the username/password fails for no apparent reason. I'm reluctant to have ozpost perform this same truncation because I beleive it may cause other issues at a later date.. The solution, reset the password to something shorter, OR, when entering it into ozpost only use the 1st 14 characters.

3. Usernames with space characters. Example "TNT Developer".
   Although these are perfectly valid names for the TNT quote server, the ozpost module doesn't URL encode the name when asking for a quote request. This causes an incomplete data string to be sent to the ozpost server and as a result neither the TNT or the Fastway quotes will show.
   This is a bug with the client code that I'll take care of with the next update, meranwhile the solution is to replace the space character(s) with a "+" (plus) symbol.

Finally, there are two main error messages that the TNT servers will return in regards to logon errors, these are both visible with the ozpost in 'debug' mode.

The 1st error "Username and password combination is incorrect" means you don't have a valid TNT online account, or, the username.password really is incorrect (see items #2 & #3 above).

The other error "The account number supplied is invalid or not assigned to this login" is telling us that the login details are correct, but the account hasn't been set up for the RTT service. See problem#1.

Hopefully this helps others out, and if anyone reading this decides to take another look into why they couldn't get it working don't be too surprised if it has somehow 'fixed itself' already - (This is because I was able to supply many of the account numbers and usernames, and have the RTT enabled, if it wasn't already).

Cheers
Rod

ps. degrandi - I was unable to get this account activated because apparently the username had been changed and I wasn't able to supply rhe current/new name.

Hi Rod,

I'm trying to decide what measurements to use on CD and DVD Cases in order to determine the best method to allow for the correct postage options..

Do I lay them flat and measure it, or do I stand it up and measure it ??

Take a Standard CD Jewel Case as an example;

If you picture an X and Y axis, I've measured it as width along the case, ( X axis, left to right) and the length from bottom to top (Y axis) and the height as the thickness,

So I end up up 14cm (w) x 12.5cm (l) x 1cm (h) and a weight of 0.1 (as my default weight is in Kg's)

And I've also tried standing the case up, and getting length (X Axis) height and width (Y axis)

14cm (l) x 1cm (w) 12.5cm (h)

Either way, if I put 1 in a cart, I get Flat Rate shipping (no rate returned), any more than 1 and standard shipping options are presented.

If I have just one case, and include anything else, standard shipping options are presented.

I know no one would buy just a single case, with nothing else, (though stranger things have happened..!) it just concerns me that I have something amiss somewhere.

I have the following options on offer;

Registered Parcel
Insured Parcel
Express Parcel
Prepaid Satchel

Version 2.08

Any clues.???

Thanks,
Mike